Part 5: Elk Hunter Meets Non-Human

“Nine years ago, I had this vasectomy and I was wondering if that was the reason that I wasn’t any good (to non-human entities)?”

– Carl Higdon, 1974 abduction while elk hunting

Return to Part 1

October 31, 2007  Laramie, Wyoming – On November 2, 1974, Leo Sprinkle, Ph.D., then Prof. of Psychology and Director of the Division of Counseling and Testing at the University of Wyoming in Laramie, Wyoming, first conducted an interview with Carl Higdon in Carl’s home, from approximately 1 p.m. to 5 p.m. In the transcription of the interview, the code below indicates the names of persons during the November 2, 1974, interview:

CH = Carl Higdon
MH = Margery Higdon
RK = Rick Kenyon
BN = Bob Nantkes
LS = Leo Sprinkle
Son = Son of Carl Higdon
Rel = Relative of Carl Higdon

Dr. Sprinkle gave Carl Higdon a deep relaxation suggestion, concluding with: “Focus on the things that were puzzling to you, or focus on the things that were interesting to you. Relax as deeply as you can and just mentally go back over that experience. You’ll be able to describe it and tell yourself what was happening at the time. Whenever you are ready, just go right ahead.”

CH:  The elk is in the clearing. (Pause – puzzled expression) The bullet didn’t get there.

LS:  It was puzzling that the bullet did not get there (to the elk Carl was shooting at.)

CH:  It hit something. I picked it (bullet) up.

LS:  You went over and picked it up?

CH:  I picked it up and then I heard somebody behind me. Then the cubicle.

LS:  Did you see yourself going into the cubicle? Or did you just suddenly find yourself in the cubicle?

CH:  No, just inside. The beacon. It’s too bright – hurts the eyes. He’s got the gun.

LS:  You saw just one who had the gun?

CH:  One.

LS:  Did you see anybody else?

CH:  No … (or maybe) somebody else. They’re comin’ after food. Explorin’. Mostly food.

LS:  Did they say what their food is, what it is like?

CH:  Meat. Concentrated food’s not enough. Other people, like me, (are) experiments. Bright lights. Landin’ down. Some other people. I’m dizzy. (Rubbing his eyes)

LS:  Lights bright in your eyes?

CH:  They hurt (eyes start watering).

LS:  Want something to wipe them with? Has anyone got a Kleenex? Here’s one. Feeling the shoulder again – the neck?

CH:  Yeah. I got a knot there.

LS:  Can you tell what it refers to? Can you think in terms of something happening at that time?

CH:  No, really I can’t. (Eyes open and Carl seemed bothered and uncomfortable).

Dr. Sprinkle tries more relaxation process with Carl and Dr. Sprinkle asks about Carl’s reference to the non-human entities traveling 163,000 miles, or “light miles” to Earth.

CH:  Different sun (they have) because our sun burnt them. That’s the reason for the black suits and standin’ in the shade.

LS:  Did they say anything about the experiments, why they were conducting experiments?

CH:  No.

LS:  Did they say anything about the star emblem on their belt?

CH:  Starship.

LS:  Starship. What about the cloud pattern?

CH:  Shape of planet. Map, ground of planet, surrounded by yellow water.

LS:  Could you see their lips move when they talked?

CH:  Yes. The gravity-levitation moved stuff for ’em. … (using) this thing from hand.

LS:  Did they call each other by names?

CH:  Ausso One – I talked to him.

(Carl talks about Ausso One being male about 6′ 1″ and about 185 to 190 pounds with hair coming out of Ausso’s head “just like wheat straw.” Carl described the clothing Ausso was wearing).

Illustration of odd, android-like entity encountered on October 25, 1974, by Carl Higdon for Mutual UFO Network (MUFON) investigator Rick Kenyon.
Illustration of odd, android-like entity encountered on October 25, 1974, by Carl Higdon for Mutual UFO Network (MUFON) investigator Rick Kenyon.

CH:  Kinda glossy and black, like rubbery, a vinyl, but you can’t get too close to see it. They won’t let you.

LS:  Was anything ever used to go over your body to look at your body, like an X-ray device or something like that?

CH:  No, just the helmet.

LS:  What did the helmet look like?

CH:  Not like a football helmet, and yet it was, except for the wires. Nothing in the front.

LS:  How many wires?

CH:  Six – two from the top, two from each side, going to the back.

LS:  The helmet was put on you when you were in the chair?

CH:  In the chair.

LS:  Did they say anything about what the helmet was for?

CH: Take readings, pressures.

(Carl discusses seeing levers and letters, E, P, H, D, P, P J, on levers in the cubicle. Ausso moved one of the levers down by simply pointing at it with his android-like arm ending in a pointed device.)

CH:  They traveled by magnetic force.

LS:  This is what they said to you?

CH:  Yeah, as fast as they want to travel.

(Carl described knowing the cubicle took off and landed in another place where “real bright light came from this spiral deal out in the middle, like a plaza.” That is where Carl also saw the “tower.”

CH:  And then t his needle-like, or this rotating eighty or ninety feet tall.

LS:  Did Ausso One tell you what it was?

CH:  No. They’re lights is all.

LS:  Did you have a feeling that it was a communication center?

CH:  No, more like an airport, maybe.

LS:  Did you see other cubicles around?

CH:  No.

LS:  Any sounds?

CH:  Something like an electric razor, or louder. Maybe more of a hum than any other kind of sound.

LS:  And then about that time, the lights were so bright, it was hurting your eyes? Did you feel any other discomfort besides the eyes?

CH:  No, just the eyes.

LS:  And you had your hands over your face then?

CH:  Yes.

LS:  And they said?

CH:  All they said was, “We’ll take you back. You’re not any good for what we need.”

LS:  Did you have any idea about what he meant?

CH:  No. Then we left.

(Carl says that Ausso then pointed at the pill food Carl was carrying and the pills “just floated away out of my pocket.”)

LS:  Did Ausso One say anything to you about whether they might come back to that same area again?

CH:  They’ll be back!

LS:  Will they be trying to find other people? Or will they be in touch with you?

CH:  No, not me! They want some younger people.

(Carl talks about the other humans who were there – only one grey-haired man who resembled someone Carl had seen on a TV program entitled The Unknown. Then Dr. Sprinkle did more relaxation and asked if anything else stood out as important for Carl.)

CH:  He gave my gun back – Ausso One, pretty good guy.

LS:  Before you fell out of the cubicle to the ground?

CH:  No, I didn’t really fall. They just put me down, gliding down and stopped. Then I slipped.

LS:  Oh, I see, you glided down (to the ground).

CH:  Yeah, and the ground was kinda rocky and then I slipped. … The fingerprint! My thumb! (Holds up his hand)

LS:  Oh, yeah, that’s the thumb. When you slipped, your thumb hit the spot, or the lens.

CH:  The front lens and the butt of the gun just scratches where it hit the rock.

(After relaxation, Carl described Ausso One, saying Ausso’s skin was smooth and did not have wrinkles.)

RK:  What about their eye color?

CH:  Kind of a yellow, like on the outside. And on the inside was kind of a dark color – maybe a dark brown and the outside was kind of a yellowish. …I was looking straight into the face (of Ausso) all the time. You never get a side view. If you wanted to communicate with them, you was looking straight into them. You never looked to the side or the back. There was just a straight front view was all you ever got.

RK:  Did they have any kind of coloration in the shoes?

CH:  They were black.

RK:  Were they separate from the uniform?

CH:  Well, you know the old pajama suit? I guess kids still wear them. They were a sock, pajama and all together.

MH:  One thing we didn’t ask is that those two guys that kind of diverted him (at top of hill before Carl went down to actually hunt). Wonder if they had anything to do with it.

CH:  No, I don’t hardly think so. Their truck had died and I helped them get it started. The battery wasn’t dead. The wires were going down to the solenoid from the battery that was broke. We had to hold it together to get it started.

LS:  These were the guys you were talking about in the interview?

CH:  Yeah, they’d stopped me. See, I was going to McCarty Canyon to go hunting. And then instead of going to McCarty Canyon, I went down to the National Forest, which is in Area 15 instead of Area 21. So, I wouldn’t think they’d have anything to do with it (what happened). …

Nine years ago, I had this vasectomy and I was wondering if that was the reason that I wasn’t any good (to non-human entities)?

LS:  That’s a good question. …It’s interesting that when you were going back, you were able to remember the little things like the rifle, the slipping and falling. But it still seems as if there’s not much information about what happened there – as if they didn’t want you to have much information.

CH:  Well, I don’t think they’ll bother me no more, and I kinda hope they won’t!

RK:  If a vasectomy is the answer – well!!!

CH:  Well, that’s the only thing that can come to my mind – that would be what they would want (sperm). …It was somethin’ that I should be able to do that I couldn’t do. The way I gathered the experience and the whole thing comes to mind would be a vasectomy.

LS:  Did you notice whenever their (non-human) lips were moving, could you see any teeth or any tongue or anything like that?

CH:  They had three teeth, that’s all (actually six). Predominant three teeth in front, big. Three on top and three on the bottom. They’re wide-like. Their mouths are not overly big for size. It’s just normal, but the teeth (were big). They didn’t move their mouths real wide when they talked. There was no difference in the color, I don’t believe, from the inside of their mouths to the outside. It was like all the same color – kinda like a yellow jaundice. Like a dark complexion person that has yellow jaundice – that was the coloring on their face. Seems to me like the inside of their lips were about the same – and no difference in the color.

LS:  Had you remembered before that there were six teeth?

CH:  Yeah – going back and talking to him while we were still – I never got outside the cubicle. I was still inside the cubicle all the time.

MH:  Do you remember seeing any other people up there?

CH:  Yeah, there was five of them (human beings also abducted). Just like the elk – there was five. But the elk – there was a bull, four cows. Then the five people. There was a little boy, two little girls, an old man and a young girl, teenager. They were down underneath the cubicle, underneath this pinnacle or whatever it is – light.

LS:  The revolving light? Was it kind of like a globe?

CH:  No, it was shaped like a Christmas tree light – big at the bottom and small at the top. But this was striped in different colored lights all through it.

LS:  Did you have a feeling of things coming out of it?

CH:  Flashing, you know, lights flying around like an airport light.

LS:  And the humans were standing near it? Or underneath it?

CH:  Yeah, they were underneath it. They were standing down on the left-hand side. There was a building and they were standing down this side of the building. We were settin’ out here in a cubicle.

RK:  Do you have any idea what color the sky was?

CH:  No. All the light took up everything. You couldn’t see through it. It was like a flash of light all the time. Maybe the only reason I seen all these people (five) there was because they were underneath the light. You could see them down below. But if you looked up, the lights were intense and you couldn’t see nothin’! How I could see that grey-haired man from a distance and relate him to this guy from The Unknown, I really can’t say.

LS:  How far away did you think you were from the beacon?

CH:  About 60 or 70 feet from the beacon. And I did see some sides. So, these people didn’t belong there. They were talking amongst themselves, the five of them, about something. I don’t know what it was because they kept looking back and forth at each other, just like a group conversation.

LS:  And when you cane back, did you have the feeling that there were others besides this one (non-human entity), Ausso One?

CH:  No, he was the only one aboard. If I can remember correctly, he was the only one I can remember seeing onboard.

MH:  Did he push you out? Or just let you out?

CH:  No, he just floated me down, like you jump out of a tree, but instead of falling, you just kin da float down.

MH:  Then they weren’t trying to harm you?

CH:  No, I don’t think there was any harmful intent whatsoever.

[ End of tape recorded portion of this November 2, 1974, interview.]

Return to Part 1

More Information:

For further reports about the human abduction syndrome, please see my books and documentaries in the Earthfiles Shop and other reports below in the  Earthfiles Archive:

  • 09/16/2007 — Part 5: Military Insiders Comment About Zeta Reticuli and EBENs
  • 09/11/2007 —Part 4: Military Insiders Comment About Zeta Reticuli and EBENs
  • 09/07/2007 —Part 3: Military Insiders Comment About Zeta Reticuli and EBENs
  • 09/05/2007 —Part 2: Military Insiders Comment About Zeta Reticuli and EBENs
  • 08/31/2007 —Part 1: Betty and Barney Hill: Captured!
  • 08/31/2007 — Part 2: Betty and Barney Hill: Captured!
  • 08/30/2007 —Part 1: Military Insiders Comment About Zeta Reticuli and EBENs
  • 08/24/2007 —Orange-Red “Fiery” Aerial Spheres
  • 08/01/2007 —Part 3, Non-Human Blonds, Greys and Big-Nosed, Cat-Eyed Lizards
  • 07/31/2007 —Part 2, Non-Human Blonds, Greys and Big-Nosed, Cat-Eyed Lizards
  • 07/26/2007 —Part 1, Non-Human Blonds, Lizards and Big-Nosed, Cat-Eyed Greys
  • 07/14/2007 —Schofield Barracks, Oahu, Hawaii – Huge, Lime Green UFO Over Battalion Headquarters
  • 05/29/2007 —Final Part 7: Eyewitness Links Animal Mutilations to Non-Humans
  • 05/13/2007 —Part 6: Eyewitness Links Animal Mutilations to Non-Humans
  • 05/11/2007 —CIA Origin of National Enquirer?
  • 05/06/2007 —Part 5: Eyewitness Links Animal Mutilations to Non-Humans
  • 05/05/2007 —Part 4: Eyewitness Links Animal Mutilations to Non-Humans
  • 04/28/2007 —April 24, 2007 – Part 3: Eyewitness Links Animal Mutilations to Non-Humans.
  • 04/19/2007 —Part 2: Eyewitness Links Animal Mutilations to Non-Humans
  • 04/18/2007 —Part 1: Eyewitness Links Animal Mutilations to Non-Humans
  • 04/20/2007 —2006 Human Encounter with Translucent Entity
  • 12/14/2006 —Abductee Jim Sparks’s Encounter with Reptillian Beings: Their Warning and Agenda
  • 10/28/2006 —Close UFO Encounter by USAF Eyewitnesses
  • 10/11/2006 —Part 2: Time Travel, Insights from USAF Sergeant and UFO Abductee
  • 10/08/2006 —Part 1: Time Travel, Insights from USAF Sergeant and UFO Abductee
  • 09/29/2006 —Manipulation of Time and Matter by Non-Humans: The Experiences of Jim Sparks
  • 09/05/2006 —Part 2: “Alphonso Lorenzo” – Military Visitor to Another Planet?
  • 09/04/2006 —Part 1: “Alphonso Lorenzo” – Military Visitor to Another Planet?
  • 06/18/2006 —Viewer Letters About NASA Airbrushing Photos; EBENs and Reptilian Humanoids
  • 05/12/2006 —An Extraterrestrial School for Humans
  • 04/28/2006 —Modern Warfare Applied to Extra-Terrestrial Invasion
  • 04/03/2006 —Genetic Harvest in Cimarron, New Mexico?
  • 02/23/2006 —Huge Boomerang Craft and Blond Beings
  • 02/10/2006 —Crashed Disc Photos, “Ebens,” and Area 51 “Anti-Gravity”
  • 01/27/2006 —Part 2: Navy Physicist and USAF Geophysicist Discuss UFOs and ETs
  • 12/02/2005 —Abduction by Grey ETs in Huge, Black Triangle
  • 10/22/2005 —A Lifting Beam Technology in Colorado Human Abduction
  • 08/11/2005 —Part 4: Two Men See Cow Mutilated in Light Beam
  • 08/03/2005 —Part 3: Two Men See Cow Mutilated in Light Beam
  • 07/26/2005 —Part 2: Two Men See Cow Mutilated in Light Beam
  • 07/22/2005 —Part 1: Two Men See Cow Mutilated in Light Beam
  • 02/04/2005 —Part 2: UFO Crash/Retrievals: Status Report V – Is The Cover-Up Lid Lifting?
  • 12/22/2004 —Part 2: “Reasons Why U.S. Government CAN’T Release Truth About UFOs!” with Canadian Researcher, Grant Cameron
  • 09/25/2004 —Part 6: “Clearview” Report on the Investigation of UFO Experiences on A Rocky Mountain Ranch
  • 09/23/2004 —Part 5: “Clearview” Report on the Investigation of UFO Experiences on A Rocky Mountain Ranch
  • 09/19/2004 —Part 4: “Clearview” Report on the Investigation of UFO Experiences on A Rocky Mountain Ranch
  • 09/18/2004 —Part 3: “Clearview” Report on the Investigation of UFO Experiences on A Rocky Mountain Ranch
  • 09/14/2004 —Part 2: “Clearview” Report on the Investigation of UFO Experiences on A Rocky Mountain Ranch
  • 09/13/2004 —Part 1: “Clearview” Report on the Investigation of UFO Experiences on A Rocky Mountain Ranch
  • 01/24/2004 —Oregon Man’s Experiences with High Strangeness
  • 10/28/2003 —Part 2 – U. S. Presidents and UFO Investigations
  • 07/02/2003 —Corguinho, Brazil: What “Spinning Force” Created the Football-Shaped Stones?
  • 06/21/2003 —Corguinho, Brazil Farmer, Urandir Oliveira, and Attorney Describe Harassments
  • 06/13/2003 —Corguinho, Brazil: Only One Bed Sheet
  • 06/06/2003 —Part 1 – Scientists Examine Samples from the Corguinho, Brazil Bed Sheet and Pillowcase
  • 06/06/2003 —Part 2 – Textiles Expert Examines the Corguinho, Brazil Bed Sheet and Pillowcase
  • 06/06/2003 —Part 3 – Infrared and Energy Dispersive Spectroscopy on the Corguinho, Brazil Round Stones
  • 06/06/2003 —Part 4 – Geologists Run X-Ray Defractometer on Corguinho, Brazil Stones
  • 03/15/2003 —Part 6 – Corguinho, Brazil: Microscopic Images from Body Pattern on Urandir Oliveira’s Bed Sheet
  • 03/08/2003 —Part 5 – Corguinho, Brazil: Large Light Explodes – Breaks Tree, Kills Calves
  • 03/03/2003 —Censorship By Omission and Comments from MUFON’s John Schuessler
  • 03/01/2003 —Part 4 – Corguinho, Brazil: Chemist and Biophysicist Examine Samples of Urandir Oliveira’s Bed Sheet
  • 02/26/2003 —Part 3 – Corguinho, Brazil: Return from the Non-Human Craft on September 18, 2002
  • 02/25/2003 —Part 2 – Corguinho, Brazil: Inside the Non-Human Craft from September 15 – 18, 2002
  • 02/22/2003 —Part 1 – Corguinho, Brazil: Farmer Describes His Transport to A Non-Human Craft on September 15, 2002.
  • 12/21/2002 —Part 2 – Corguinho, Brazil: Close Encounters with Tall Red-Haired and Blond-Haired Non-Human Beings
  • 12/19/2002 —Part 1 – Corguinho, Brazil, Alleged Human Abduction and Photos of Body Marks On Bed and Ceiling
  • 04/16/2000 —A Close Encounter with a Disc in Wyoming
  • 10/24/1999 —A U. S. Army Infantryman’s Abduction
  • 06/22/1999 —The Strange Story of J-Rod, An EBE


Majestic 12 Documents:

John E. Mack Institute:

Intruders Foundation:


© 1998 - 2023 by Linda Moulton Howe.
All Rights Reserved.